Dementia Discussions

How Music Unlocks Memories in Dementia Patients

• Barbara Hament • Season 4 • Episode 11

Share episode

Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.

0:00 | 45:57

Caregiving for a parent with dementia can bring moments of profound love, grief, humor, and connection — and my conversation with Laura Kanofsky captures all of it. Laura shares the story of her mother’s journey from successful entrepreneur and fiercely independent businesswoman to living with dementia, while reflecting on the emotional realities of becoming both daughter and caregiver.

We also explore the extraordinary impact of music therapy in dementia care and hospice. Laura explains how music can unlock memories, create emotional connection, reduce anxiety, and offer comfort even in advanced stages of dementia. From difficult decisions about caregiving and placement to meaningful moments created through music, this conversation offers insight, compassion, and support for caregivers navigating the dementia journey.

Episode Highlights

[0:00] - Laura shares the emotional challenge of explaining her father’s death to her mother after dementia changed her memory and understanding.

[1:00] - I introduce my longtime friend and colleague, Laura Kanofsky.

[3:13] - Laura reflects on her mother’s successful career and fiercely independent spirit before dementia.

[7:45] - We discuss early cognitive decline, vascular dementia, and the transition from home care to assisted living and board-and-care.

[10:21] - Laura shares how dementia changed parts of her mother’s personality and behavior.

[12:10] - Laura explains why a smaller board-and-care setting became the right fit for her mother.

[14:59] - We talk about grief, “therapeutic truth-telling,” and her mother’s confusion surrounding her late husband.

[18:20] - A conversation about friendship, community, and staying socially connected during the dementia journey.

[19:20] - Laura shares how she became a music therapist and why music is so powerful for people living with dementia.

[23:24] - We explore how music therapy supports memory, emotional connection, and engagement.

[25:18] - Laura discusses balancing her personal role as a daughter with her professional work in hospice and music therapy.

[27:35] - We talk about how music created meaningful moments of joy and connection between Laura and her mother.

[30:11] - Laura explains how music therapy can encourage storytelling, reminiscence, and emotional expression.

[31:56] - Laura shares experiences from her work in mental health, hospice, and autism care.

[36:07] - We discuss Laura’s work with Dynamic Hospice and Palliative Care and the role of music therapy at end of life.

[38:57] - Laura shares how she helps families create legacy playlists and personalized memorial music.

[42:38] - We reflect on empathy, compassion, and understanding the whole person in caregiving.

[45:08] - Laura and I close by reflecting on the supportive community serving older adults and caregivers in Los Angeles.

Do you have a caregiving story to share? Barbara would love to hear from you! Please leave her a message at 310-362-8232 or send her an email through DementiaDiscussions.net. If you found value in today's episode, please don't forget to rate, follow, share, and leave a review. Your feedback helps us reach more listeners and continue producing this content.

 

 

 

 

Laura Kanofsky:

So about a year and a half ago, she started to ask about my dad more frequently, and it got to be one of those situations where you don't know whether it's best to remind someone that he has passed, that he died, or to kind of just play along and not we said, oh yeah, he went to play golf or, you know, whatever. And my interpretation is that she couldn't tolerate that he had actually died, and she would fill in with this notion that I think he's in jail. I don't know what happened. And I tried to gently remind her about his having been sick and you know he had died, you know she just had this moment of just profound sadness, and she said to me, you're very brave to tell me

Barbara Hament:

Hello and welcome to season four of dementia discussions. I would really like to take a moment to thank the guests who were on this past year and to thank you the listener. I really could not do this show without you. And over the past couple of years, some of you have called me, so I am encouraging more of you to pick up the phone and call me. I'm accessible, and I'm so eager to hear your story. I'm at 310-362-8232, or you can email me at dementia discussions.net so again, thank you. I'm grateful for you, and so looking forward to another year of us being together. Hello and welcome to dementia discussions, the podcast for and about caregivers today on the show, I am thrilled to welcome Laura konowski. I have known Laura for 30 years, at least more. Wow, yeah. As a Laura has been a friend and colleague and has several different capacities. I'm not sure if that's a blessing or a curse in the in the senior world here in Los Angeles, but first, I think we should probably talk about your role as a caregiver. So most importantly, right?

Unknown:

Yeah,

Barbara Hament:

being the caregiver to your own mom. Absolutely talk about your other roles. I'm so happy to see you.

Laura Kanofsky:

Thank you. I'm honored to be here with you. Barb,

Barbara Hament:

so let's start by talking about your mom. You know, I remember, years ago, we were talking about your mom as this business woman, right, this smart, like, financially sharp woman who, you know, had a lot of wisdom to impart,

Unknown:

yes, right? Yes,

Barbara Hament:

that changed over time. So shed some light. I had bombed those years ago. So tell us, right,

Laura Kanofsky:

yes, my mom, she was born and raised in Montreal, she was a school teacher from a very young age. She left teaching, dabbled in different things, got involved in sort of human resources with a focus on like the legal world, and was administrator of a sort of prestigious law firm in Montreal. They moved in middle age, she and my dad to California, and wound up in a similar position in a century city law firm and discovered that using agencies for very special positions wasn't like always the best. They didn't always provide the most ethical service or whatever, and so she had this fantasy, got a lot of support, started her own business in legal staffing, which just grew and grew. She got all these honors, so she was savvy, but it was also, you know, she always said it wasn't a passion, but it was. She saw the need. But the truth is, she ran it really like, kind of like, I think all her employees felt like family members. They loved being there, and she ended up, you know, the business was bought by by a big international company, and she ran around, you know, opening offices in all these different cities. So it was quite a success story, which, in and of itself wouldn't mean that much. But again, it was the you. You know, the integrity with which she ran it, the respect that she garnered, and I was incredibly proud I have. I'm not a very entrepreneurial person, and that wasn't, you know, just kind of intriguing to me and she ended up consulting to a very big law firm. After she sold her business, she found out retirement was not for her. She wasn't a hobby person and and she was very, very. Most people that knew her, even fairly well, thought of her as this kind of independent feminist, you know, go getter with this big, warm personality. And those of us really close to her knew that she was all those things, but emotionally she was very, very dependent on my dad. They were very, very connected. They had a beautiful marriage, and my dad died 20 years ago, and I had times that I really wondered, would this be like a broken heart syndrome, kind of, you know, would she make it? You know, would she be able to thrive without him? And she was so sort of surrounded in love and had so many people in her life, and that was true to the end, lots of visitors, lots of friends. I mean, you know, as people develop dementia, there are always a lot of people that kind of fall off, and that certainly happened that just don't know how to be around that. But anyway, so she really, she, she just died in November. She was 92 and so around mid 80s that we really started to see some change even a little before that. But she, I can't remember when it was, but it was probably 1012, she did have a stroke. She also went through open heart surgery for a valve replacement, and the recovery really set her back the immediate recovery, and she kind of never quite came back to baseline, and then it was just to this day. I don't know if there are some indicators that it would be vascular dementia and others that would sort of suggest Alzheimer's, and I think it might have been a mix. And so she got to where,

Barbara Hament:

so she was at home. When she

Unknown:

was

Barbara Hament:

home, when this all started, right?

Laura Kanofsky:

She was at home in her lovely home. And you know, unfortunately, my dad had had passed, and you know, wasn't there to be her number one guy. So I began to assume that role. I am one of two kids and the only one on the West Coast, and I know that that's a familiar story to many and and I adore my mom. So of course, I wanted to do everything. So it started off caregivers at home, then live in caregivers at home, then when gradually and eventually walking and even bearing weight became difficult. She she moved into assisted living, but did not do well. And I think that might have been partly my own denial of how things were really moving along. Cognitively were really, you know, that the illness was progressing. So she was thinking

Barbara Hament:

that she would be like she would thrive in assisted living. Yes, she was beyond that level. I see

Laura Kanofsky:

she she had agreed that everyone said you're, you know, you're so social, seems a shame for you to be at home, even though you know she would go out with her caregiver a lot, but then the mobility issues really got in the way, and there started to be a little bit of personality, just seeing more irritability and occasionally a little bit of belligerence, which is a very hard thing for me, especially to see, because that was so so very uncharacteristic. I mean, my mother was someone who just loved people who loved and had huge empathy for the underdog. Like, who would, you know, stop people on the street, like an elderly person to say they looked beautiful, or, you know, to coo over a baby. And so that that was a little hard, but that was sort of a relatively brief period, and there was a

Barbara Hament:

belligerent about, like, care, or what was, Were there certain triggers for her belligerence?

Laura Kanofsky:

Yes, I think there were. I think it was, like a lot of ambivalence about having caregivers at all. And

Barbara Hament:

I would imagine, since she was such an, like, independent,

Laura Kanofsky:

right? Kind of fiercely independent,

Barbara Hament:

yeah,

Laura Kanofsky:

and she did like being the boss, you know, it's like, I'm in charge. That's what she would kind of assert, you know. And I think it was very connected to this in internal fear and on some level, realization that she was losing control over things and that that felt really, really bad. So, so when she moved into assisted living, it was right on the cusp of covid. She had a couple of falls. She had one bad fall, went into the hospital, and when she went into rehab to, you know, recover and improve after the fall and regain strength, she contracted covid, and so she was back in the hospital, back into RE it was kind of one thing after another, and then she did have a small stroke. So it was a really, really rough period. And from that point, I realized that a small setting was really needed. She went into boarding care, a wonderful board and care home that you know well, and I know well professionally, and really did very well, was generated here. Got

Barbara Hament:

the care she needed,

Laura Kanofsky:

excellent care there, and but the decline continued gradually. There's a lot that I'm so incredibly grateful for. And one of those things I was always, you know, kind of bracing myself for the day that she wouldn't recognize me. And that never happened. I'd walk in the room and she'd call me by my nickname, lowly, hi, Loli. And, you know, really a lot of her personality remained. And you know, partly from my personal experience with my own grandmother, her mother, who had a relatively like 70 ish years old, onset of Alzheimer's, we presume, Oh, wow. And partly from my professional experience and just anecdotal, I, you know, you get to where you know how I knew how to be with her and how to optimize our time together, mostly focusing on kind of remote, remote memories, and especially anything about my father that she just, she just cherished him and she, she missed him acutely, until, you Know, very close to her death, she just really always longed to be with him. I hope she's with him. Yeah, yeah. So, in fact, interestingly, you know, she, she, I would say about a year and a half ago, maybe two years ago, she started to ask about my dad more frequently, and it got to be one of those situations where you don't know whether it's best to remind someone that he has passed, that he died, or to kind of just play along and not but I thought, no, she, she, she's still got presence of mind enough to process this and get it. And so I said, and you know, the caregivers very well meaningly, we're like, well, we kind of distracting her. We said, Oh yeah, he went to play golf, or, you know, whatever. And she said, Laura, I haven't seen daddy. Do you know? Do you know where he is? And I said, mom, and I, you know, kind of tried to gently remind her about his having been sick. And,

Unknown:

you

Laura Kanofsky:

know. So first a little indirectly, and then more clearly that he had died. And, you know, she she, oh, my God, of course. And then she said, Oh, you know, she just had this moment of just profound sadness. And she said to me, you're very brave to tell me. You're very brave to tell me this. And I thought was so fascinating that there's still this part of her that is observing, you know, that is aware, yeah. And I thought that that would kind of do the trick for a while, but, you know, within weeks, if not sooner, she's like it was so interesting, she couldn't My interpretation is that she couldn't tolerate that he had actually died, and she would fill in with this notion that I think he's in jail. I don't know what happened. She couldn't make sense why she hadn't seen him like, why would he not be with her,

Barbara Hament:

right? So that's the story she came up with.

Laura Kanofsky:

Or I think he might be having an affair, and I'd say never, like he was. My dad was so adoring of my mother, and so that was just painful to hear. But anyway, so

Barbara Hament:

maybe you're right, like, maybe it was a good thing that you said he's not here, because he's not alive,

Laura Kanofsky:

right? Like,

Barbara Hament:

he can't I felt like, yep, right. It just would alleviate her. The truth, yes,

Laura Kanofsky:

right. So anyway, but yeah, she, you know, I was very, very blessed to have this team, and then ultimately a hospice team as well. You know, the team at the boarding care home who

Barbara Hament:

they adored her. They really loved your mom. They

Laura Kanofsky:

did. And then, you know, having these visitors. But that was really interesting. You know, of course, I was making a lot of decisions going over when I would talk to her on the phone, and she'd sound a little anxious, or just going over kind of every other day, and and then it got to, just lost my train of thought. You were starting to talk about hospice bringing right, yes, that she had these, yeah, so she had this great care, and she also had really quite a number of friends, I think, you know, often people get to this stage of life, and the circle gets very small. You know, it gets to be family, sometimes just family, you know, spouse or offspring, adult children. And my mom really, you know, especially considering I think she was 48 and my dad 50 when they moved from Canada to California, many, many enduring relationships. So there were a lot of people that would come. And, you know, we still did. We did even a little birthday party. I didn't want to overwhelm her. But that was just about a month, month and a half before she died.

Barbara Hament:

You would go on Fridays.

Laura Kanofsky:

Oh, I'd go a lot.

Barbara Hament:

You'd go a lot, including Fridays

Laura Kanofsky:

during the day. Fridays, I'd usually go Sunday morning, you know, I'd go a lot. And it got to where the friends who, you know, that was real comfort to know she was being visited by people, they started to feel a little uncomfortable being alone with her, and they kind of wanted me there. So I really understood and appreciated that, but it became a little challenging to juggle work and my visits with her and then also be present for these social visits and coordinating them and whatever, but, but I was just very grateful that, that she had those, those people in her life and and, you know, and music was a very big source of connection. So let's

Barbara Hament:

chat about that. You are my all time favorite music therapist. Well, thank you. Oh, absolutely. I've referred lots of clients to you for music therapy,

Laura Kanofsky:

yes, and I'm so thankful for that, so thankful for that. It's been such a wonderful part of my work life, and

Barbara Hament:

blessed with an amazing voice, right, right, perfect pitch, and it's such a great goodness. Yeah, you're, you

Laura Kanofsky:

know, I don't think of myself as a I really have never had voice trade. But, you know, the but I use it a lot, and I'm very comfortable with my voice, you know? So, yeah, it's a funny thing. So music therapy was something, you know, this too is really very much, very much attributable to my parents, who were both like depression babies and didn't have a lot of extras as kids, and discovered, you know, they married very young, and they boy, we both love music, but neither of us have training. I guess it's too late for us. You know, like 21 and 23 and

Barbara Hament:

let's save it to the kids. Yeah, right, yeah, they ensured

Laura Kanofsky:

that my brother and I got very early exposure, and there was this fabulous music school, and I was four years old, and it was just kind of magical and and from there, you know, classical piano lessons starting, I think, at age seven, and then I really wanted to learn guitar, because that was such a cool instrument and accompany myself, you know, singing. So I did that at age nine for a few years, and had a great teacher, and that just kind of stuck as well. And so I was studying, I was in college, sort of different school system in this part of Canada. And you, anyway, you have this area of general area of concentration. And I was studying, like, sociology and psychology, you have, like, a and someone did a presentation on music therapy. And I thought, wow. Like, delightful. So I found there was no internet. This is, like the late 70s. I I found this one introductory class to music therapy and that kind of that was it. And you know, part of the fascination with music as therapy was, as I mentioned, my own grandmother, who was to the point where, like, she was still verbal, but it was kind of what we call confabulation. She wasn't really having meaningful conversations, and yet, I would sit down at the piano or the guitar play songs from like 40 years prior, and she would sing the entire lyric, and our whole family would be like in a puddle, because we were so moved, and we thought that this was a miracle. And you know, when I went on to study music therapy, I learned that this is fairly commonplace. And then later, you know, they started to do all this research about, you know, these sort of functional MRIs, and learn what is actually happening in the brain in the presence of mute either listening to music, improvising music, playing music. And anyway, without getting too in the weeds, you know, there's a part the prefrontal cortex like that just stays very much intact, and music is a direct connection, it turns out, a direct link to remote memory, to emotions,

Unknown:

you

Laura Kanofsky:

know, and and to other things, to motor centers. So there's so much potential for music as a therapeutic tool. And so seen

Barbara Hament:

it so many times. Yes, right?

Laura Kanofsky:

Yes. I mean, there's that movie alive,

Barbara Hament:

oh, Glen Campbell's movie too, right? Yeah, almost movie, right? Yes, those are great movies, so

Laura Kanofsky:

you know. And you see people that are so withdrawn into themselves, who just really something,

Barbara Hament:

are not very indicative, right? And then you start playing right. Let's say their toe is tapping

Laura Kanofsky:

right.

Barbara Hament:

Exams are going and and

Laura Kanofsky:

even, like, remembering some things and, you know, interesting.

Barbara Hament:

It's just amazing,

Laura Kanofsky:

right? I mean, and I've seen the progression from someone who, like my grandmother, or other people that I've actually worked with professionally, who who go from where they can sing the lyrics, all the lyrics come back to where they're humming. Maybe the the words are forgotten, but the melody is still remembered,

Barbara Hament:

right

Laura Kanofsky:

to where, like you said, you just see, you know, that movement like that, they're connecting. It's not, you know, sometimes it's very subtle, but it's, it's a great it's a great way. It's a great inroad, really. And you. Yeah, as a social worker, you know, I'm also a social

Barbara Hament:

so then yes. So okay, so getting back to your mom, like circling back to your mom for a minute, yes? So as she declined, you brought in hospice, and you happen to be a hospice social worker, yeah, Laura,

Laura Kanofsky:

music therapist,

Unknown:

and

Barbara Hament:

music therapist,

Laura Kanofsky:

right?

Barbara Hament:

So how was that for you?

Laura Kanofsky:

You know, I it was really great. I was a little reticent at first, and I thought maybe I want to have a different hospice that I don't know all the people, because the merging of, you know, the professional and the personal, it just felt like that might be strange, but I worked with a really, really great team, and such a wonderful nurse. Was my mom's nurse, and I was so it just made all the sense in the world. So I just was so fortunate to have that, and it really wound up being a very positive thing for my mom and for me, just the communication was fantastic and and, you know, I my colleague, whose name is Barbara, was actually assigned to be the social worker on the case, and she had met my mom before. So so it was, it was wound up being really, really good to have that. But my using music with my mom far predates yes for being under hospice care. We did it all the

Barbara Hament:

time. Yeah, Shabbat with all with the guys over there and your home mom, yeah,

Unknown:

you

Laura Kanofsky:

know, but my I think of it as my parents. You know, when I think of music and my family, I think both of them just loving being in the car with them, you know, loving Broadway shows. I grew up in a French speaking part of Canada, so if like French Canadian folk songs, Yiddish music, the old standards, you know, kind of everything and and so there was always a lot to share, and I would sit at the piano at the boarding care and, and it was really hard to stump my mother. I'd start playing something, and

Barbara Hament:

she'd remember,

Laura Kanofsky:

right? And, you know? And that is part of the beauty of music therapy with people with dementia is, you know, the sense of mastery that is achieved when there often is, as I talked about earlier, that lack of, that feeling of a lack of control, and the, you know, not being able To do so many things that one was able to do. And then here are not only the memory for the for the words of the song, but, you know, we also the feelings that are associated with the music come back. I mean, most people I talk to have had that experience of whatever age, you know, oh, wow, I remember where it was when I heard this song, and what I was doing and who I was. Oh, you know, so it's, it's also the sort of totality of the experience that is such a gift to have, as well as feeling, you know, like I can, I can do this, I can sing this song, I can play these drums. I can, you know, shakers.

Barbara Hament:

Did you learn a lot about like your mom and also the other residents there, you know, when they would start to sing and say, Oh, I remember this song.

Laura Kanofsky:

Yes,

Barbara Hament:

you know, yeah, I don't know whatever it was, definitely,

Laura Kanofsky:

you know, sometimes the part that requires a little bit of detective work is that with kind of moderate to more advanced dementia, it's very hard for somebody to pull out of a hat, like the name of a song or a singer, like, well, I like this. They can't quite initiate that

Barbara Hament:

right?

Laura Kanofsky:

But so finding, like, the right genre the right, you know, sometimes takes a little bit trial and error, but it's usually pretty like, Oh, Frank Sinatra, or Yeah, The King and I, or

Barbara Hament:

exactly, and then you tap into it, yeah. And everyone starts singing, yes,

Laura Kanofsky:

yeah. So yes. And that was a beautiful thing to be with all the residents, like

Barbara Hament:

they would say, Oh, I went to see that show on Broadway, that sort of thing, right?

Laura Kanofsky:

And share, share memories that get sparked, and that is often.

Unknown:

And

Laura Kanofsky:

also, part of the the beauty of doing this is that music can be a bit of a springboard for, you know,

Barbara Hament:

reminiscing sort

Laura Kanofsky:

of life review and things that, you know, memories that might not otherwise like come up. So, yeah, so that is, and that is a lot of what I do with the private clients that that you refer to me, and that others refer to me, and then, and then I get to use this tool in hospice work as well. You know, I it's, it's interesting, because for quite a number of years, before working in hospice, I What? Well, I worked at a state mental hospital as a music therapist, and then decided to go back to school. Just a personal decision. I felt that music I found that it was so powerful that I felt like I wanted to develop more of the therapy part of music therapy. I mean, you could always be a better musician, but I am very fortunate, very comfortable using as a musician in in music therapy. And so I really felt that part needed some developing. And just because my personal values are very aligned with social work values, that became clear that that was the path to pursue, and, and, but so I went back and got a MSW at UCLA, but before that, working at a state mental hospital with people who are very, very impaired, very involved, you know, often schizophrenia and you know,

Barbara Hament:

chronic mental illness,

Laura Kanofsky:

yes, you know, really persistent, often people who are just not as responsive to medication

Unknown:

as

Laura Kanofsky:

some are. But even in that setting, you know, one of the things that another music therapist there and I did was something called an MTV group. Dates, me to be clear, this was the 80s and and, but absolutely fascinating that like there's one person that comes to mind, and I still remember his name, who to try to sit and talk with him in it, in a group setting, or even one to one, was very challenging, because he'd start responding, as we say, to internal stimuli. You know, he was hearing voices, but the rhythm and the meter of music, and he happened to be a bit musical, so he would sat down at the keyboard, had a microphone. And we, because we, what we would do is take familiar songs, let's say Beatles songs, and and write lyrics that they wanted to write about something the group wanted to write about, fit it into the song and then videotape, and he could sit there and play and sing into that microphone. And the organizing quality of music, organizing of the brain, was really very clear and very moving and and I've seen that. I've seen that same effect with I've worked pretty extensively with, it's on the autism spectrum, dementia, you know, there, there's a common thread there that, I mean, I think all the arts are really powerful. There's, there's something in music that, that it's a time ordered thing, and, you know, it happens in time. And there's a structure to That within which you can be creative, right? Improvise, but you have

Barbara Hament:

harmonized. You could write, yes, yeah, right. Did your mom have a good voice?

Laura Kanofsky:

She did not have a great voice. She sang on pitch, which was good, but it was like a little squeaky, you know, just No, but you know, to me, it was,

Barbara Hament:

it didn't matter,

Laura Kanofsky:

fine, you know, sure, of course. I mean, I probably didn't even really notice that until I was older, because I think we all love our mom's voice, you know, singing or singing to us or whatever. But later I realized, oh yeah, this, but you're saying on on key and, yeah, so, yeah.

Barbara Hament:

So it was a bridge, a connection that you can have with your mom for so many years. You know,

Laura Kanofsky:

I really have her and my dad to thank for. You know that? That exposure to music that ultimately led me to music therapy. And then here I am at the very end of her life. You know, using music quite a lot, and and, yeah, my daughter has been very involved in musical theater, and she was visiting a lot in the last week and singing to my mom when she really was, you know, not really outwardly responsive in the very end, but that was beautiful. Beautiful too. So anyway, through

Barbara Hament:

the generations, yes, very sweet.

Laura Kanofsky:

Yeah, yeah.

Barbara Hament:

So anything else should I ask you? Anything else about your mom hospice? Anything else you want to cover? I mean, you talked about it beautifully.

Laura Kanofsky:

Sure

Barbara Hament:

points you want me to keep key up? Oh, you want to mention?

Laura Kanofsky:

Could mention that I, you know, kind of wear both of those hats in hospital. You know that I, yeah, do both in a hospice, or that I do see people privately.

Barbara Hament:

Okay, okay, so how do you you're, you are a hospice social worker and, and I think it's okay to say you work for dynamic, right? We could say the name, yeah, so it's dynamic hospice. Is it just dynamic hospice?

Laura Kanofsky:

Dynamic hospice and palliative care? Yes.

Barbara Hament:

Okay, so you work for dynamic hospice and palliative care here in Los Angeles,

Laura Kanofsky:

I do.

Barbara Hament:

It's not a national company. It's a local company, or it's

Laura Kanofsky:

a local company. They do have a couple of other offices, one in Nevada and Oh, and another one on 1000 Oaks, but

Barbara Hament:

got it?

Laura Kanofsky:

Yeah.

Barbara Hament:

And how do you so you come in as a so you lead as a social worker.

Laura Kanofsky:

I do. It's interesting because I started working in music therapy as a music therapist. I worked with another hospice for a long time and many years and and went to dynamic and, and, but, you know, over time, I started to do social work as well in hospice. And so social work is a required service to offer in hospice as part of the regulations of hospice, music therapy is not but music therapy is in more and more hospices. So it's really, I do. You're right. I mean that exact, exactly it I lead as a social worker. I'm usually assigned to cases as a social worker, I'm quite part time with dynamic but they will refer cases to me if they have gotten the the sense that this family might benefit from music therapy, since I wear both of those hats, or sometimes I will just plain old be assigned to a case, and I'll mention to the family that this is one of the things that I offer. And you know, sometimes people just don't want to have any ancillary services. They just want to have the nurse come and and, but so they are about to say no to social work, to spiritual care, that some of the things that are offered volunteers in hospice, and then they hear music, and they get a little kind of piques their interest, or they say, Gee, my dad or my wife, or whatever is really into music, that might Be a good you know, so that ends up working out. And in the hospice setting, I've done so many things. I mean, I've written songs with people. I've set their poetry to music. I have just done singing when, like, we just talked about with dementia.

Unknown:

I

Laura Kanofsky:

have helped people put together a legacy playlist. I have created a playlist for someone's own memorial service. I've used music improvisationally to express feelings, and sometimes do family music therapy, where I take a song and it may be familiar or unfamiliar, and just kind of adapt the lyrics where there's kind of a fill in the blank and people get to say something that they want to say to their loved one, that again, the structure, you know, of music allows that without it being too threatening, they don't have to just sit there and dictate, you know, like a whole dedication, but just like, oh yeah, this is something I value about you, and it's in a musical context. So it's like moving around and the next person takes a turn. So sometimes that can be really valuable. You know, sort of the beginning of having clues. Closure in a way

Barbara Hament:

that's so beautiful. I never thought about that, like coming up with the playlist for someone's funeral,

Laura Kanofsky:

right? Yeah,

Barbara Hament:

that's wonderful, yeah.

Laura Kanofsky:

So. And then, of course, we do have people with, you know, really quite end stage dementia and and there it's closer to what we were talking about before, where it's just that feels familiar, and there's a comfort and the familiar and and also the use of, you know, the merger of spirituality and music. So sometimes that could be religious. It could be, you know, playing and singing hymns. It could be, you know, any number of

Barbara Hament:

So, do you know hymns from different faiths?

Laura Kanofsky:

I do. I do. Yeah.

Barbara Hament:

How great is that, right?

Unknown:

Right? I do. Yep,

Laura Kanofsky:

it's that. That can really be a very, very meaningful experience too,

Barbara Hament:

huh? And then you see people privately, which I'm sure is very rewarding. Yes, you get to see hospice. Tends to be short, right? That's

Laura Kanofsky:

right.

Barbara Hament:

And

Laura Kanofsky:

sometimes it goes on for a while,

Barbara Hament:

right?

Laura Kanofsky:

But Jimmy Carter was a good was a good example.

Barbara Hament:

Now, that

Laura Kanofsky:

can happen, and then it's legitimate. It can be, you know, sometimes a decline is slow, but yes, generally it's weeks to months. And so, yes, with private clients, I get to have a longer term

Barbara Hament:

relationship,

Laura Kanofsky:

relationship, yeah, and that's really, really nice. You know, really have the opportunity to deepen the relationship. I mean, it's a professional relationship, but that there is an intimacy to it, and that is very special. Really get to know somebody's music and their life and yeah, kind

Barbara Hament:

of melds social work with right? Yeah, music absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

Laura Kanofsky:

I'm so, you know, I'm so grateful from as I practice music therapy. I'm very grateful for my social work training and experience. I really am. It's made me a much better music therapist, because I feel like I have that lens, then

Unknown:

it

Laura Kanofsky:

just sort of broadened the the lens through which I see the people I work with and and the skills, you know,

Barbara Hament:

right? The skill set,

Laura Kanofsky:

yeah,

Barbara Hament:

yeah, because you can talk about end of life and not shy away,

Laura Kanofsky:

right, right?

Barbara Hament:

It can be present for people,

Laura Kanofsky:

yes, and really understanding people's process. You know, part of what drew me to social work versus studying psychology or doing a different degree that would lead to a different license, was this notion of person in situation. And, you know, the my grandmother that I talked about her husband, my grandfather, was a really incredible human being, and my mom's dad and he, I can remember, I quoted him in my application to social work school, because I remember being, I don't know what age I was, but being a kid and coming home, and he was over at our house and being very upset someone had been mean to me, and I said, I hate her. And he was like, we don't say hate. And he really went on about the need to understand why somebody you know, maybe she had this going on in her life, or maybe, you know, and and that notion that, that same concept of person in situation, right, you know, it was

Barbara Hament:

gaining empathy for her, some kind of compassion for what she might be going through. Yeah, anyway,

Laura Kanofsky:

so, so, yeah, very I really thought when I went to social work school, I thought it was to just to be a better music therapist, but I was happily surprised to find out that I identify strongly as both and very proudly. So

Barbara Hament:

I'm so glad, I'm so glad that you bring both to your work,

Laura Kanofsky:

your

Barbara Hament:

passion is, it's just, I know when I refer people to you, they're going to, you know, just, I don't even know. I'm like, filled. I'm cavelling, you know, thank

Unknown:

you,

Barbara Hament:

Barb, yeah, it's such a great experience for them. I know it so I hear about you well, see it,

Laura Kanofsky:

I am very, very truly blessed to have a colleague like you and to know, I mean, I think in LA there's just, I'm not the I'm not a super networky person. But. But wow, what an amazing community of people who work with the aging population and

Barbara Hament:

that we have here. We're so fortunate. Really are well. Thank you for coming on today. I so appreciate you professionally and personally as a friend, Laura, thank you.

Laura Kanofsky:

It's my great pleasure and honor, and those feelings are very mutual, and I think you know that thank you very happy to have been here.

Barbara Hament:

Thank you for joining us today on another episode of dementia discussions. If you're a caregiver, or know someone who's a caregiver that would like to be a guest on the show, please call me at 310-362-8232, or go to dementia discussions.net. Forward, slash contact and let me know. I would love to have you remember that you can follow dementia discussions on Apple podcasts, Spotify Google podcasts and many more. If you listen on Apple podcasts, it would mean a lot if you would leave me a review for any other information about this podcast, please visit me at dementia discussions.net. And please share this podcast with someone you know, if you think it may help, thanks again for listening, and I'll see you here again next time on dementia discussions.

Unknown:

You.